Alright my friend just bought 2 15" kicker L5 and 2 kenwood 9102d. The subs are rated at 750wrms each, and each amp is rated at 850wrmsx1 @ 2-ohm. So each of the dual 4 ohm subs are wired to 2 ohms. Now my question is, since he is running two amps in a 2003 single cab dodge pickup, what size wire does he need? 2 or 0 guage? Each amp has two 30 amp fuses, so does he need at least 120amp fuse on the power? Also do you think the stock alt is good enough for these two amps? If not, what size should I get? He lights dimmed badly with just one amp hooked up. Sometimes the amps shut off. Im thinking because they are not getting enough volts ( they shut off when you play them real loud ). Thanks for the help guys. - Jacob
2awg would work, but of course, the bigger the better. Anything you can do to give the amplifiers all the current they need will help them run more efficient. A 120 amp fuse should be adequate, but you could go bigger if you run larger wire. (rememgber, the fuse by the battery is to protect the power wire, NOT the amplifier) And< USE A WAFER FUSE!!!! not the cheesy little junk agu type fuses! A good quality wafer fuse and holder is the ONLY way to go in any install that is drawing high currents, period. and speaking of wire, be sure the amps have as short as ground as possible and are grounded individually to a solid, clean point.... If you are having your lights dim with the beat of the music with one amp, It will get worse with 2 amps... As is mentioned here in other posts, first thing to do is get some 4 gauge wire, run a wire from the output of the alternator to the positive battery terminal (run in a safe manner, it wont have a fuse!!!!) Next, run another wire from the engine block to the neg. side of the battery, then from the negative side of the battery to the chassis of the vehicle. This will alww the stock electrical system to do ALL that it can. Then as far as alternators go, get one that is about 60 amps higher than what your current factory rig is, but again, bigger is better here also! So if you find one that does 70, 80, 100 amps over stock output for a good price, get it.... one more thing, dont let someone talk you into buying a "cap" for your system, they are a complete wast of money and will do nothing to benefit your audio system, the money is better spent on upgrading the stock electrical system.
Well I think that answers all my questions. Thanks. I think I will probably go with the 0 guage power. Does the ground need to be that big? 0 guage power then have it split to 2 guage to each amp. I will look into a bigger alt, but might try what you have just told me.. Will that cause the alt to go bad quicker? I mean if the amps are pulling to much anyways the alts going to go bad anyways lol. Just wondering the side affects. Thanks
Make sure to get a distribution block for the power wire to split it to the amps...Also a distribution block would make grounding the amps easier. Yes use the same gauge ground as power. Why restrict the system with a smaller gauge ground. As for the engine block ground you don't have to run it to the battery...Most cars have a wire from the block to the chassis...Running a new wire from the block to chassis may be a little easier also. If you get a high output alternator and upgrade the big three you should be fine and the alternator shouldn't go out if its beefy enough...First upgrade the big three...easiest and cheapest thing to do first...then see how badly his lights dim...Case will probably be that they will still dim slightly then go for the new alternator.
As far as the grounds go, i DO NOT reccommend the use of a distrobution block to split the ground wires to the amps, they each need to be on thier own ground wire, ideally. Whatever size power wire is feeding the amps, is what size you should use for the grounds, and again, this is important, keep them as SHORT as possible, and be sure to use a good SOLID connection to the chassis of the vehicle, The best method is to drill a hole, sand away all the paint down to clean shiny metal, and install them with a nut and bolt with washers.....then spray some paint or undercoating on the connection to prevent corrosion. As far as the alternator taking a dive sooner with the upgraded wiring, Ya, sure, it may allow it to puke sooner, after all, the new wiring will allow it to do all tht it can while it can, but in all the years of my doing this, I dont really remember that ever being a problem. And I have done it to literally hundreds of vehicles. You should be fine in soing the upgraded wiring is what I am saying!
Viking, why would using a dist block for the grounds be bad? I mean if he's splitting the 0 gauge to 2 gauge for the amp couldn't you use 2 gauge from the amp grounds to a dist block then from the block to the chassis with 0 gauge?
Thanks for the help... again this is my friends vehicle. I just don't want him to get 2 capacitors. To be honest, IMO I think they would be useless in this certain situation. I mean his lights dimmed bad with one amp. Not only that when we played it loud for a minute or two with both amps hooked up, you could see his battery gauge dropping lol. I just read some information about batterys and alternators to better understand them. Plus I just like to read things about electrical currents. Or maybe I just like to know how everything works lol. Anyways, the wiring the alt to the battery to make it put out all it can, I just do not want to tell him to do that in case anything goes wrong. Plus I do not know how exactly how to do it nor do I want to attempt to try. If it was my own vehicle I would give it a try. Anyways, after that is all said, what size alt do you think would be better? It is a single cab dodge ram 2003. That is all I know about it. Also about the ground for the amps, they are connected to his seats where they bolt down to the floor. Which I have told him to sand down. The amps are under the seat, so the ground could be shorter than 1 foot (which from what I am understanding, the shorter the better). I will tell him to use 0 guage for the power then split it to 2 guage for each amp. I will use 2 guage for the ground also. If everything sounds good to you all let me know. Thanks for the help Also what is a dist block exactly? Don't you put 1 wire in one end then it splits into 2 wires or more? Like what we would use for the power to go from 0 guage to 2 guage?
-For the big three, after reading this you will feel confident. It is very simple. http://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?TID=73496&PN=1 If he's not gonna upgrade the big three than might as well not get a new alternator and get a 100 farad cap. Yes a distribution block splits a single wire into many...If going from 0 gauge to 2 gauge he will need a fused distribution block...Always use a fuse when going from a larger power wire to a smaller power wire.
The reason i am against a distribution block for grounds, is due to a few reasons........ first, they are usually cheap gold plated blocks, and the cheesy gold they use is electro plated on to the base material in a msot "economic" way, not good for conductivity. Second, the extra resistance of the terminations/screw down terminals is not good Third, the ONE wire that is ultimatly grounded to the chassis, will be "saturated" with excessive current flow over the long run. Works good for a starter or another short term high current device, but NOT for amps that are run hard at all times... I have personally machined ground distrobution blocks out of copper and brass, and the final destination for the ground was to the frame using a HUGE homemade 3/4" id ring teerminal....most folks wont or cant do this..... Oh, and the seat bolts for grounds...BAD IDEA!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Make a REAL ground for the amps.....the seat bolts are not a method to ground amps, they are for holding the seats in. Over time, the slight movemnet of the seats will cause the terminals to compress and lose connection, not a good thing...... At least that is my reasoning for what I do, but, yall do what ya want! Not my amps!!!!LOL!!!!!! Sorry, that last staement was not really called for, Its just that I take the proper instalation of car audio seriously, it makes for a happier customer, or user if you will in the long run!
Well I never thought about the extra resistance but I see what you mean. I don't use distribution blocks for my grounds but it was just a suggestion for the man.
Well I thank you for the help.. We'll try to locate a more secure ground. I'll just explain to him that either you can install everything half a$$ and your system crap out on you in a year or you can do it the right way and it will last much longer. He's looking into another alternator. I've printed out that page about the Big Three, but have not given them to him yet (he doesnt have internet). What exactly do you mean by that.. The ground will slip out over time? Or something will damage the amp (or both). Thanks again, Jacob
I know this has nothing to do with the title of this thread.... but I was thinking of putting a system in my 2003 altima. I do not really want alot of bass (it already hits pretty good with the factory) but a really good sound quality sub. Now the little tiny problem is that I have Bose premium sound with a 6-disc indash cd changer. I also have a stock bose amp in the back. From what I heard bose car stereos are pretty complicated. I guess my question is, do you know if there are any pre-outputs on the radio or a wiring kit? I know how to take it out, I just have not done it yet. I hate it sometimes because I rather put a computer under the seat and a monitor where the cd changer is, but the cd changer is an oval shape kind of. So if you know an oval shaped touchscreen let me know!! lol.
Most connectors are made of copper or brass. Over time, they compress. Take for axample a copper wire tied into your circuit breaker in your house, It is torgued down at say 100 inch pounds. Go back to the same terminal an hour later, and you wil turn the screw another half turn to get 100 inch pounds. they compress over time and lose connection. And the slight movemnet of the seat when you ride in it, get in and out of it, etc, makes the matter worse, it compresses the connection and it loses it conductivity, cuasing higher resistance, heat and eventual failure of the connection all together. Ask an electrician if ya dont believe me...........same principles apply to the connestions we make in car audio........
I think I understand. I believe ya, I wouldn't be on here asking questions if I wasnt going to listen to anyone on here lol. We'll look and try to locate another place. What he really needs to make the subs sound better is a better box. Is there a program to figure out what a sub can handle in a certain type/size box. I know how to figure out the internal air space, but I believe there is a little more to it than that. I know with ports, a certain size/depth of the port can change the frequency or Hz right? But what about a sealed enclosure? Do you just go with the recommended internal air space or can the shape of the box make a difference? Well first things first, I think we are going to take care of the wire/electrical problems. They are more important in my opinion lol.
Not EVER tryin to be arguementative in here, just going with what I know works..! In smaller less current demanding systems, you can get away with it, but it is NEVER the ideal way to ground amps.....At least in my opinion!
WinISD is a free box building program...Very helpful Enclosure is 99 percent of the installation...good sub plus crap enclosure equals pile of poop...decent sub in well built and designed enclosure equals good output and sound quality.
