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Subs only work if balance is all the way right or left

Discussion in 'Car Subwoofers' started by Eubank, Nov 3, 2006.

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  1. Eubank

    Eubank Full Member

    Help! I have installed many stereo systems and have come across a new problem. I am running a four channel Alpine amp with 2 10" Xtant subs. I am using channels 1/2 on the amp and have the subs wired in parallel. I have the amp bridged. When I have the balance on the HU in the middle there is very little bass. If I move the balance all the way left or right I get the good bass I am expecting. Someone suggested the RCA's but if I had a bad RCA would that not prevent sound out of at least one side, R or L? But I am getting sound out of both, just not at the same time. I have messed with every setting on the HU and amp and nothing works. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
     
    Eubank, Nov 3, 2006
    #1
  2. Willy D

    Willy D Full Member

    Sounds to me like you have something wired incorrect or configured incorrect on the amp.....What head unit and what amp are you using??

    Model numbers??

    Willy
     
    Willy D, Nov 3, 2006
    #2
  3. Eubank

    Eubank Full Member

    HU: Pioneer DEH-1600
    AMP: Alpine 3553 4/3/2

    I have messed with every setting and nothing seems to make a difference. Of course with all the combinations I could be missing something. But with the balance in the middle there is nothing I can do to get good bass out of the subs.

    What setting could effect the sound only when faded all the way to the left or the right, but not the middle. The other wierd thing is that this scenario does not change when I go from having the amp bridged across the L and R channel or having just the right channel hooked up, I still get good bass out of both channels of the HU. I am so confused.
     
    Eubank, Nov 3, 2006
    #3
  4. Willy D

    Willy D Full Member

    I tried to find the manual for the amp online...I could not find it....let's start from the beginning...

    I believe your head unit has one set of pre-outs....if the RCA is connected to that and running to the amp (sounds like it is) that is the start....Now it sounds like you have two subs wired in parallel, that means that you are only connecting one set of speaker wires to the amp...correct? I am not sure if bridging the amp makes chan. 1&2 become one channel and 3&4 beome one (making this four channel amp into a bigger two channel amp...I assume this is the case) Now...Do you have switches to flip to make it "bridged"? Usually if you do have a switch then you use two specific wires out of the four that you connect....for example....channel one pos. speaker terminal (on amp) may be the speaker pos. connection point...then channel 2 pos (on amp) becomes the speaker negative connection point...Sometimes on an amp it may call for using only one of the rca connectors (usually left) for the input...

    Tell me exactly what terminals on the amp you are connecting RCA to and exactly what speaker wires to what amp terminals......

    I wish I could find a manual for this amp to look at....I could be more help...But don't get frustrated....we will get it fingured out....Not sure if you can snap a digital picture and attach to this thread....That would be helpful too....I think this is a simple fix.....

    Willy
     
    Willy D, Nov 3, 2006
    #4
  5. Eubank

    Eubank Full Member

    Everything you are saying is dead on. One set of RCA's coming out of the radio. The amp is 4/3/2. The speaker wiring is how you described.
    I have attached a picture of the amp connections. The balance adjuster on the radio is acting as a volume control. I see the "mono" connection on the amp, but I have had this amp in three different vehicles and have never had to use it. Could it be the way the HU is configured (first car for this HU). Sorry about the picture, the amp is in the trunk and was a bit tough to get. And when I resized it to fit the forum the focus wet to crap. Basically as you see it the Let me know what else you need. The blue wire is the R RCA the white is the L RCA (this says MONO). And the speaker connections are on positive Channel 2 and Negative Channel 1.
     

    Attached Files:

    Eubank, Nov 3, 2006
    #5
  6. Willy D

    Willy D Full Member

    A couple things you could try.....

    Sounds like it is something with this head unit....try this....

    If you have a home cd player, or a walkman, etc...that has capabilities to send out an RCA signal, connect it to the amp and see what happens...Just remember to turn your amp gain ALL THE WAY DOWN if it is like a home CD player, because it will give you full signal continuous (very loud)....Another thing you could try is to go down to radioshack and pick up an RCA "Y" cord....Take the two RCA's and unplug them from the amp...Connect the "Y" plug to those two and then plug the single end to the "mono" input on the amp...see what happens (it will be female RCA on the double end and male RCA on the single end) I have had to do this in the past to sum the left/right and send into the mono input....You may wanna try the RCA "Y" first...If that does not solve it, then try the home audio player (or another head unit that you can just temp wire in the trunk to connect.) If neither one of these does the trick, it will most certainly be in the amp somehow....

    Willy
     
    Willy D, Nov 3, 2006
    #6
  7. Eubank

    Eubank Full Member

    I will give the "Y" a try tonight. That makes sense to me because I would be merging the R and L channels into one taking the balance feature out of the equation. I just don't understand why I have to this with this radio and have not had to do it in the past. I will let you know how it turns out.
     
    Eubank, Nov 3, 2006
    #7
  8. Willy D

    Willy D Full Member

    It could possibly be in the design of the head unit...As the signal flows into the amp through the RCA's, your amp may only be flowing signal through this mono input....Somehow that may be putting the balance of the signal leaving the head unit off kilter somehow...other head units may have been designed differently and not been affected by this....Maybe this Pioneer unit is trying so self balance and not doing it....The head unit thinks it is sending a stereo signal out....I don't know

    If you think it could be in the amp, you could also try using the other two channels (bridged). Put the RCA's into the other two channels, and swap your speaker wires to those channels....

    Typically the signal should remain the same in the center position or balanced to one side...it will get more volume to your ears simply because of the summing of the two channels (in stereo)

    Let me know how you make out....

    thanks

    Willy
     
    Willy D, Nov 3, 2006
    #8
  9. Willy D

    Willy D Full Member

    Real quick, just out of curiousity....Unplug the blue RCA from the amp...Just use the mono one....Does anything change?

    Willy
     
    Willy D, Nov 3, 2006
    #9
  10. Eubank

    Eubank Full Member

    I actually just did that on my lunch break, no change. I had also tried hooking up to channels 3/4, no change. Something in the HU is restricing output in the center position. It is like moving the balance to one side is adjusting a gain setting, but meanwhile it will cut off the respective speakers in the car.
     
    Eubank, Nov 3, 2006
    #10
  11. aznboi3644

    aznboi3644 Full Member

    Hold on...most amps have the RCAs on top of each other...check your RCA connections on the amp..they look wierd
     
    aznboi3644, Nov 3, 2006
    #11
  12. Willy D

    Willy D Full Member

    Well...I would try doing the RCA thing and summing the sides....If that does not work, it has to be a problem in the head unit...How old is the unit? Do you still have a warranty? could you maybe call Pioneer's tech line?

    See what happens......hope that summing does it....If not...that sucks!
    I hate it when things do not work as they should....You have everything connected correct (you already knew that).....I don't see where anything in the unit could be set differently to make this problem go away, but never say never.....

    Good luck.....Let me know....I got my fingers crossed..

    Willy
     
    Willy D, Nov 3, 2006
    #12
  13. Eubank

    Eubank Full Member

    I am positive the RCA are connected correctly. Plus if you look at the orientation for the speaker wires (ch 1/2 on top, 3/4 on bottom) The RCA are setup the same way( 1/2 on top (side by side)).

    I bought the car used this week, came with the HU. It has a box and all the manuals, I actually read the manul to see if it said anything, no luck.

    Keep those fingers crossed tight!!
     
    Eubank, Nov 3, 2006
    #13
  14. aznboi3644

    aznboi3644 Full Member

    Well my friend had an alpine 4 channel and yes the speaker outputs are horizontally placed but the rcas where vertical...wouldn't hurt to check.

    I've never seen an amp that had the left and right rca inputs next to each other horizontally

    Just because the speakers are horizontal doesn't mean the rca inputs are
     
    aznboi3644, Nov 3, 2006
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  15. Willy D

    Willy D Full Member

    Looks like at the top of the ones to our left say "right" above them and the ones on our right say "left" (mono).....Both "rights" are on one side and left on the other side....Hard to see, but I think he has them right.....You might be thinking that both "rights" are on the bottom and "lefts" on the top....

    I think he has it connected ok....as far as I can make out from the picture..

    Willy
     
    Willy D, Nov 3, 2006
    #15
  16. aznboi3644

    aznboi3644 Full Member

    Eh...well I can't really see it as the picture is quite blurry lol

    From the pic you can't even make out what it says as its a white blur
     
    aznboi3644, Nov 3, 2006
    #16
  17. Eubank

    Eubank Full Member

    Sorry about the picture, when I resized it it got all fuzzy.
    I just went out and verified that ch 1/2 are on the top. I messed with the wires and with the amp on "mono" there is no bass with balance in the middle. Does not matter if I have the blue wire or the white wire plugged into the Left "mono" channel. also does not matter if both are plugged in. It is extremely noticeable when I adjust balance to one side, just like a gain control.
     
    Eubank, Nov 3, 2006
    #17
  18. Willy D

    Willy D Full Member

    If you bought the car with this HU in it, I assume you did not wire it (in the dash)....Have you checked to be sure if someone else wired it, that it is correct up there?

    Willy
     
    Willy D, Nov 3, 2006
    #18
  19. Eubank

    Eubank Full Member

    I have thought about that but what could be wired incorrectly to make it do what it is doing. The balance adjust controls the speakers in the car (hooked directly to the HU) correctly. so what else would effect how the HU controls the subs? If you can help point me in the right direction I can take a look.
     
    Eubank, Nov 3, 2006
    #19
  20. aznboi3644

    aznboi3644 Full Member

    Um...check if the rcas are connected all the way in

    There's only one set of preouts
     
    aznboi3644, Nov 3, 2006
    #20
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