What's It With Y'all And Subwoofers?

I'm gonna have to get back to this one.. It is definately interesting what you're saying

 

I didnt care up until a year or two ago - i saw the light
and saw that there was soooo much more to having a better
sounding car...

but a sub IS definitely a very important part of the equation
try listening to most rap songs without a sub and you'll see why
they're totally LIFELESS without having that bottom end supported
you dont even need good main speakers for that type of music.....

...like so?

 

OK, just because we do a lot of talk about subs doesn't mean we're forgetting about the most important part of the equation, the front stage. The reason i couldn't respond at first was because i had to go out and lay another layer on my kick molds. I've been putting a lot of consideration into my entire setup lately, minus my sub.. I haven't given my sub a second thought since i got my Dub Sebbin. I know what enclosure its going in, what it'll be powered with, and where it'll be crossed and such. Thats a done deal. Now im tryin to better my front stage. I got kicks in the build process, i got 2 sets of capable midbass drivers in my hands and im tryin to decide what to use. I got a 5.25" comp set that will be going in the kicks. Now im scrambling to get power for everything up front. I need 6 channels of amplification, and i'd like to do matching amps. My sub amp is a PG titanium 600.2 just to give you an idea of how much money is gonna have to go into my front stage.

See, the important things aren't going ignored, they are just going untalked about.

:bye:

 

Shoulda bought some Kodas .

I think for the most part, a good set of comps will be pretty accurate. When we get into comps, I think subjective and objective take on a whole new meaning.

I know what is a good set of tweets to me. But if you are like Cort (hahahaha, you knew this was comin' didn't you ) you like bright ass laser pointer screaching tweets . Seriously though, while a really good MBQuartz tweeter can be quite flat on an RTA, I find them bright. It may just RTA as flat as a Koda tweet, or JLXR tweet yet the brightness is very obviously differant .

where the subwoofer frequencies are omnidirectional, the upper frequencies are not. When it comes to the upper frequencies we listen to, we are beginning to focus on sound absorbtion and reflection and what the overall affect of them will be. Then we need to consider our application.

When you hear it said that installation is everything, my personal belief is that is all about your comps. I'll spend a month driving around in my car (my system is after all a daily driver system, I don't care about comps ) and tweeking just the slightest bit to compensate for things like my normal leg position while driving, the fact that I lean over to the right, but not too far, just so my nose points at the right apex of my steering wheel, etc. Where my sub enclosure will affect this somewhat, normal adjustments in phase and gains will easily correct this. With a front stage, little tweeks can be catestrophic.

Also, considerations including bi-amping, crossover design (or elimination), and other processing are also important variables.

If you are an audiophile, comps are not just drop in performance. where a sub is. Comps are more personal than a sub, as they are asked to reproduce more difficult frequencies, and more of them. I hate to reccomend comps (with any seriousness, I may kid some, but rarely will I be adamant), but subs are a bit easier .

 

I agree, Luvdeftonz.

Bass is TEH SUCK compared to the other frequencies!


For all you non-believers, wait until you hear the Watt/Puppy 7.......



ROCK HARD, THROBBING ERECTION

:unsure:

 

Shoulda bought some Kodas .

[/b][/quote]
Revelator and high end Vifa own teh Koda....

 

Revelator and high end Vifa own teh Koda.... [/b][/quote]
How bout Seas Lotus Reference? We might have to find out soon Seth .

 

Revelator and high end Vifa own teh Koda.... [/b][/quote]
Maybe, if you enjoy what I consider a fatiguing mid.

 

Maybe, if you enjoy what I consider a fatiguing mid. [/b][/quote]
Who in Greensboro has Revelators?!?!?! You need to let me know when and where i can get an audition for those .

 

Who in Greensboro has Revelators?!?!?! You need to let me know when and where i can get an audition for those . [/b][/quote]
I've not heard the revealtors, sorry I should have been more specific I have heard a few sets of Vifas though, on various levels.

 

I've not heard the revealtors, sorry I should have been more specific I have heard a few sets of Vifas though, on various levels. [/b][/quote]
Ok...i figured you woulda told me if you'd heard the Revs.

Personally i can't put Vifa on the same page as Scan Speak from the reviews i've read and the experience i've had with Vifa. For the money Vifa is pretty tough to beat, but if money is no object Scan Speak Revs would probably sound better than any one of Vifa's drivers. I haven't heard of anything from Vifa comparing to the Revs anyway.

BTW, what Vifa mids have you heard besides the cheapo PL's?

 

Maybe, if you enjoy what I consider a fatiguing mid. [/b][/quote]
I've heard them and a lot of other people as well.......especially in midrange, the KODA gets owned by the Revelator and a lot of Vifa units..

 

I think that a lot of people do put more into subs. I really don't get why as you said...

Why are people willing to spend 500 to 1000 on subs and an amp then when you say like 300 for comps they are like thats way too much....so everyone sugges 100 set of comps... uke:

Me I was just the opposite I spent more on my comp set than both subs combined. The only reason my sub setup came out to be slightly more than the mid/high setup is becuase of the amout of power I required for the subs.

I'd much rather have a killer fontstange and a decent sub setup....Nah...Id rather just have both!

 

I've heard them and a lot of other people as well.......especially in midrange, the KODA gets owned by the Revelator and a lot of Vifa units.. [/b][/quote]

And my conclusion is I like the less agressive mid

As I stated earlier, front stages are entirely too personal.

 

Revelator and Excel own everything....

 

there's no way any of this stuff can begin to compete with my factory GM 6.5" 1 ways...they 0wN j00!

eric

 

I just want to say my sole purpose for car audio is to scare small children, ooohhhhh and lets not forget, attacting jailbait lol

 

is that the only way you can attract girls?
damn.......desperate.....

 

If the question is "why are subwoofers talked about more often than comp/coax speakers", I think there are a bunch of good reasons, like them or not.

Most of us start into car audio because we want that boom, seeking bass that can crack pavement...
Once you get into car audio, most people gradually shift toward the SQ side of things, but the common ground is still there.

Also, the car is absolutely ideal for making huge bass.
In a car, you have cabin gain working for you, in your efforts, boosting bass frequencies at a rate of 12dB/octave below the car's unique interior resonance frequency...

Conversely, the car is an absolutely horrible place for sound quality.
Lots of challenges. The only positive in a car are predictable, consistant seating locations, which you don't have in a home... of course, that CAN be a huge advantage.. but the small interior, combination of many close-coupled reflective and absorbtive surfaces, and fundamentally poor stock speaker locations certainly make getting "reference" quality sound in a car a real challenge.

Subwoofers in cars are very objective to discuss (ie. not a lot to be disputed).
The specs can predict their performance much more accurately than higher frequency drivers, in part because the human tolerance for hearing detail is much much lower, the lower in frequency you go... things are more equalized among us.
One aspect that's particularly important to many subwoofer enthusiasts (obviously) is decibels, and that's also measureable with equipment, very objective.

On the other hand, as objective as subwoofers are, component speakers are exactly the opposite... very subjective.
In fact, all the specs you care to name don't add up to the kind of difference that can be perceived under all sorts of different installations, different angles, different power, etc.
Human hearing (converse to the above) is more sensitive to detail, the higher you go in frequency... so many more people will hear minute differences between sets... and this is the frequency range where a "trained ear" will pick up on different things than a novice...
And novices may loathe the very things that a more "trained ear" might love.
Very subjective.

Makes it difficult to discuss anything regarding speakers like these, because anyone can (and probably will) dispute anything that's said, with or without credentials, and they really can't be challenged about their statements, pro or con, because it is so subjective.

Which makes it difficult... how do you know who to trust, with regard to this?
How would you like to find out that you've been following the advice of a 14 year old keyboard commando whose extent of audio experience is a Sony headset and a GPX boombox? h34r: